[C38] Listserve Digest, Vol 6, Issue 443 (onboard weapons) alden

Sat Dec 11 13:51:01 EST 2010

I have to agree with my friend north of me on the weapons. I personally
have a 12 gauge Remington marine stainless steel pump on board. I carry
several rounds slug, buck shot, been bags, tazer rounds. I also have two
glocks a 17 9mm and a 17 45 cal. I don't carry the pistols in Canada but
I do keep the shotgun on board. I got the guns do to a couple of
experiences that I needed them. I have been boarded both by the US coast
guard and the Canadian Coast Guard and have declared the weapons and
have not had a problem.

Alden Andre (AKA Cpt. Bilgewater)
S/V FLYBYE
503-929-8814

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Subject: Listserve Digest, Vol 6, Issue 443

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: On Board weapons (Steve Smolinske)
   2. Re: Out of line....but we were talking about weapons
      (Steve Smolinske)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:41:17 -0800
From: "Steve Smolinske" <SSmolinske at rainierrubber.com>
To: "Catalina 38 Listserve" <listserve at catalina38.org>
Subject: Re: [C38] On Board weapons
Message-ID: <392501BCC93AAC4EA94D28D8DB1599226927C7 at sockeye.4M.local>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

I am a firm believer in gun rights and personally have several shotguns,
assault rifles and handguns, I have a concealled weapons permit too.
With that said I do not carry a gun on my person or on my boat and I
keep them locked in a safe with trigger locks.  It's your right to own
firearms and even carry them but with that comes a huge responsibility
too.  

Before my in-laws went to Alaska for the summer on their boat some 15
years ago Dad bought a Winchester Stainless steel marine shotgun.  As
they were gone for three months and all alone in very very remote areas
they felt it prudent as did we.   Its a short version of the standard 12
guage.  I now have it but have never taken it aboard as I have'nt seen
the need cruising around the sound or the San Juans, If I ever felt the
need it would be my weapon of choice.  The sawed off 12 guage for a boat
offers many advantages the primary one being fire power!  You have the
option of every kind of load imaginable from slugs to bird shot, I also
have 12 guage non-lethal rounds that fire pepper spray, tear gas, flash
bangs, rubber pellets and one that shoots a stream of fire about 100
feet (Larry during transpac keep your distance at night and make sure
your boat is well lite :) ) you can even get flechettes too.  Best of
all in the dark if you were to say stop I have a gun that might n
 ot work, but if you pump a round in the chamber that is all that it
normally takes to strike fear to the bone in most people.  Any round
fired from a shot gun at night will put on quite a light show and scare
off any would-be intruder.  I read an article some years back in Ocean
Navigator about a cruiser making his way into a mexican port late one
night at the end of a long voyage, he had a persistant radar target that
he was worried that it was a pirate.  He tried hailing on the VHF,
altered course several times and the target altered as well and kept
closing.  He could'nt decide if it was a fisherman following him or a
pirate, he got his shotgun fired a round into the air in the pitch black
and the target changed course and never reappeared.  

Side note on firearms, with the litigious climate we live in many law
abiding citizens who have used firearms for valid self defense reasons
have found themselves imprisioned or bankrupt defending themselves.  For
home defense my weapon of choice is a glock model 21 (.45 caliber)  and
the first round in the clip is a rubber round, if you should ever have
to use your weapon and injure or kill someone a rubber round shows that
you at least tried everything possible before using lethal force (even
when the SOB is in your home).   If you do decide to have a gun be
mentally prepared to use it, the worst thing that you could do is to
have someone take it from you and then turn it on you.  Go to the range
or the woods and get comfortable using it, if you ever have to use it
that would not be the time for indecision or confusion about its
operation.  Also if you keep a gun on the boat, make sure you strip it
first and liberally oil the barrel and firing mechanisms.  Use trigger
locks
  and never keep a round chambered especially on a boat. IMHO. 

 Word of caution when walking the dock carrying one of these to or from
the boat it normally gets really quiet.  

<http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:D9ltmiws86a8yM:http://world.guns.ru/
shotgun/winchester_1300_coastal_marine.jpg&t=1> 

Steve
#312 Peregrine
Seattle

________________________________

From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org on behalf of Tom T.
Sent: Fri 12/10/2010 2:02 PM
To: Catalina 38 Listserve
Subject: Re: [C38] On Board weapons

I'm with Wm. Knowles on the flare gun possibly blowing up with shotgun
shells.

Even if your gun survived the shotgun shell, your assailant you shot
would probably be very agitated and annoyed at you for scaring him with
a flare gun.  The slow burning powder of a shotgun shell needs at least
a few inches of barrel to get any energy.

Back in the 60's some scuba divers started carrying 12 Ga. bangsticks to
defend against sharks.  Some guys used the much smaller .44 magnum
revolver cartridge bangsticks which proved to have much more power than
the larger 12 Ga in a very short barrel like a bangstick.

If you reloaded a shotgun shell with a faster burning pistol powder, the
flare gun would make a powerful weapon.  If the shotgun shell shot
didn't kill your assailant, the hand grenade that used to be your flare
gun would probably kill or maim you both. 

Just douse them with gasoline and shoot them with a safe, standard Olin
flare.  On second thought, never mind......

Tom T.
Red neck in Gun Toting, Bible clutching GaJaw

	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: William Knowles <mailto:whk1965 at gmail.com>  
	To: Catalina 38 Listserve <mailto:listserve at catalina38.org> 
	Sent: 12/10/2010 4:33:53 PM 
	Subject: Re: [C38] On Board weapons

	They make this insert that will fit in your flare gun and in
shoots I think 38 cal bullets. Be good you only get one shot if your
target is close. They are legal and do not need to be declared so the ad
says. I would not shoot a 12 gauge shotgun shell in a flare gun I do not
think it can handle the load and will probably blow up in your hand. 

	Bill Flying Goose

	On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:16 PM, Jay Sorensen
<jsorensen at novarx.com> wrote:

		A very good question!  My father is actually a felon in
Canada for not reporting a firearm (pistol) and then having one found
when they searched his RV.  He was a 60 year old ex Marine who always
?carried? on trips but didn?t really think about it because he was not a
hunter, etc.  Talk about embarrassing, and expensive! 

		My understanding is the bows, crossbows, flareguns, and
spearguns, are not controlled like firearms and can be kept on board
without problems.  Just don?t use them for fishing without a license!

		I thought about using a flare gun as the basis for
protection but am not sure how to go about it.  Maybe someone out there
has some experience??  I think a flaregun that fires 00-buckshot would
be cool, but what about that recoil!

		Jay Sorensen

		C-38 #311 Broad Reach

		San Diego, CA

________________________________

		From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org
[mailto:listserve-bounces at catalina38.org] On Behalf Of Craig Steinkraus
		Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 12:01 PM
		To: Catalina 38 Listserve
		Subject: [C38] On Board weapons

		There has been conversation before about the pros and
cons of carring weapons on board while crusing. My personal opinion is
on the fence. I would like to carry one, but , do I really need one, and
am I willing to put up with the hassle of declaring it at every
potential port of enrty? It has been suggested that I hide one on the
boat, but in reality, custom officials probably know of more hiding
spots on the boat than I do, so that is not a viable option.

		 My question is if a crossbow is considered a weapon,
and if so, would it be treated the same as a handgun? If someone on this
site has any insight, please share it, even if it's to where I might
look to find an answer.

		Craig Steinkraus

		"Wingss" C-38 #280

		_______________________________________________
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	-- 
	W H Knowles

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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:46:15 -0800
From: "Steve Smolinske" <SSmolinske at rainierrubber.com>
To: "Catalina 38 Listserve" <listserve at catalina38.org>
Subject: Re: [C38] Out of line....but we were talking about weapons
Message-ID: <392501BCC93AAC4EA94D28D8DB1599226927C8 at sockeye.4M.local>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Im laughing so hard!! please tell me its not true

________________________________

From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org on behalf of Patrick Harpole
Sent: Fri 12/10/2010 10:34 PM
To: Catalina 38 Listserve
Subject: [C38] Out of line....but we were talking about weapons

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Peter Jensen <mailto:jenpeter99 at gmail.com>  
To: Patrick Harpole <mailto:1derful at comcast.net>  
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 5:28 PM
Subject: Fwd: Welcome Home from the TSA

Sent from my Mattel kiddie phone

Begin forwarded message:

	From: Janet and Peter Petersen <janetnpeter at gmail.com>
	Date: December 10, 2010 7:42:23 AM MST
	To: Peter Jensen <jenpeter99 at gmail.com>
	Subject: Fwd: Fw: Welcome Home from the TSA

	---------- Forwarded message ----------
	From: Gerry Lumenello < <mailto:lumi2 at cableone.net>
lumi2 at cableone.net>
	Date: Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 2:43 PM
	Subject: Fw: Welcome Home from the TSA
	To: 

	To: <mailto:1color at optonline.net> 1color at optonline.net,
<mailto:cooken at optonline.net> cooken at optonline.net,
<mailto:denny at denelle.com> denny at denelle.com,
<mailto:everettwfrey at hotmail.com> everettwfrey at hotmail.com,
<mailto:FCHunter3 at aol.com> FCHunter3 at aol.com,
<mailto:tfrost7678 at aol.com> tfrost7678 at aol.com,
<mailto:rpaulgallant at yahoo.com> rpaulgallant at yahoo.com,
<mailto:Jeff at lavatyart.com> Jeff at lavatyart.com,
<mailto:tomar37 at optimum.net> tomar37 at optimum.net,
<mailto:MLPape at aol.com> MLPape at aol.com, <mailto:pwj at frontiernet.net>
pwj at frontiernet.net, <mailto:jeff.strauss at raveis.com>
jeff.strauss at raveis.com, <mailto:tlowrie123 at gmail.com>
tlowrie123 at gmail.com
	Date: Thursday, December 9, 2010, 11:14 AM

		What part of DUMB don't they understand??????????????
		As the Chalk Leader for my flight home from Afghanistan,
I witnessed the following: 

		When we were on our way back from Afghanistan, we flew
out of Baghram Air Field. We went through customs at BAF, full body
scanners (no groping), had all of our bags searched, the whole nine
yards. Our first stop was Shannon, Ireland to refuel. After that, we had
to stop at Indianapolis, Indiana to drop off about 100 folks from the
Indiana National Guard. That's where the stupid started. 

		First, everyone was forced to get off the plane-even
though the plane wasn't refueling again. All 330 people got off that
plane, rather than let the 100 people from the ING get off. We were
filed from the plane to a holding area. No vending machines, no means of
escape. Only a male/female latrine. 

		It's probably important to mention that we were ALL
carrying weapons. Everyone was carrying an M4 Carbine (rifle) and some,
like me, were also carrying an M9 pistol. Oh, and our gunners had M-240B
machine guns. Of course, the weapons weren't loaded. And we had been
cleared of all ammo well before we even got to customs at Baghram, then
AGAIN at customs. 

		The TSA personnel at the airport seriously considered
making us unload all of the baggage from the SECURE cargo hold to have
it re-inspected. Keep in mind, this cargo had been unpacked, inspected
piece by piece by U.S. Customs officials, resealed and had bomb-sniffing
dogs give it a one-hour run through. After two hours of sitting in this
holding area, the TSA decided not to re-inspect our Cargo-just to
inspect us again: Soldiers on the way home from war, who had already
been inspected, re-inspected and kept in a SECURE holding area for 2
hours. Ok, whatever. So we lined up to go through security AGAIN. This
is probably another good time to remind you all that all of us were
carrying actual assault rifles, and some of us were also carrying
pistols. 

		So we're in line, going through one at a time. One of
our Soldiers had his Gerber multi-tool. TSA confiscated it. Kind of
ridiculous, but it gets better. A few minutes later, a guy empties his
pockets and has a pair of nail clippers. Nail clippers. TSA informs the
Soldier that they're going to confiscate his nail clippers. The
conversation went something like this: 

		TSA Guy: You can't take those on the plane. 

		Soldier: What? I've had them since we left country. 

		TSA Guy: You're not supposed to have them. 

		Soldier: Why? 

		TSA Guy: They can be used as a weapon. 

		Soldier: [touches butt stock of the rifle] But this
actually is a weapon. And I'm allowed to take it on. 

		TSA Guy: Yeah but you can't use it to take over the
plane. You don't have bullets. 

		Soldier: And I can take over the plane with nail
clippers? 

		TSA Guy: [awkward silence] 

		Me: Dude, just give him your damn nail clippers so we
can get the f**k out of here. I'll buy you a new set. 

		Soldier: [hands nail clippers to TSA guy, makes it
through security] 

		To top it off, the TSA demanded we all be swabbed for
"explosive residue" detection. Everyone failed, [go figure, we just came
home from a war zone], because we tested positive for "Gun Powder
Residue". Who the F**K is hiring these people? 

		This might be a good time to remind everyone that
approximately 233 people re-boarded that plane with assault rifles,
pistols, and machine guns-but nothing that could have been used as a
weapon. 

		Can someone please tell me What the F**K happened to OUR
country while we were gone? 

		Sgt. Mad Dog Tracy
________________________________

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