[C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
Steve Smolinske
SSmolinske at rainierrubber.com
Wed Sep 14 02:07:28 EDT 2011
Anders
Are you referring to Tiburon? If so you may point out to her that in the Coastal Cup this year they finished 360 miles in approx 45 hours thats like 6.8 knots, we finished in 64 without flying a spinnanker that is 4.8 knots, Hey I like her math better can you send me the forumula this means we were doing something like 16 sustained.......Damn way to go Crew!
________________________________
From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org on behalf of Pierre Patino
Sent: Tue 9/13/2011 11:00 PM
To: Catalina 38 Listserve
Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
My Catalina 38 does Warp 8.5 while cruising San Francisco Bay.
Sometimes in the slot while the tide is 5.3 knots abeam and the wind
is a mere 38 knots astern i can get to warp 8.7. It's a logarithmic
scale. Warp 9 means that the hull will dissolve due to friction.
That's tonight's logic
On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Anders Finn <anders at finn.ws> wrote:
> I think the question is more of surging vs sustained speed. We've narrowed it down to inside SF bay so they're not surfing. I still don't believe the 26 knots surging (without tide) inside the bay. . Just dont. I CAN believe 16 knot surges though for a few seconds.
>
> They do claim 23 knots sustained surfing during the costal cup. . Course, we've done 15 knots surfing on our c38 when no one else was watching. . .right dad? hehe
>
> Anders
>
>
> On Sep 13, 2011, at 10:37 PM, Steve Smolinske wrote:
>
>> Maybe the confusion is incorrectly using terminology planing versus surfing, our displacement boats and all displacement boats can catch a wave and surf.
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org on behalf of Patrick Harpole
>> Sent: Tue 9/13/2011 10:29 PM
>> To: Catalina 38 Listserve
>> Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
>>
>>
>> I referred to a "displacement " which cannot plane. I have about 20,000 pounds in my keel. It will not plane.
>> There is no limit to the speed of a planing vessel. That's is why catamarans go mast.
>> While in Florida I saw Whitbread (if you are not familiar....this is a race around the world) boats. I would not call them nor America's Cup boats displacement vessels. They are very light and have winged keels that bring them out of the water.
>> Patrick
>> P.S. what is the fastest tack for a sailing boat? Clue: it is not downwind.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: David A Hadfield <mailto:dahadfield at gmail.com>
>> To: Catalina 38 Listserve <mailto:listserve at catalina38.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 6:16 PM
>> Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>> On being uninformed.
>>
>> The SC37 can plane in downwind attitudes,
>> ie. go faster than calculated hull speed.
>>
>> These are apples and oranges and one must be careful on exactly what one is addressing.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 6:10 PM, Patrick Harpole <1derful at comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I sail a Catalina 38 and reached 12 to 14 knots sailing from Benecia to Berkeley. The reason for the speed is an ebb current at 6 knots.
>> There is no way a displacement vessel can reach greater than their calculated hull speed. When one exceeds hull speed they are unduly stressing their rig...which might come down. What a shame for being stupid.
>> Patrick
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <david at dlrfilms.com>
>> To: "Catalina 38 Listserve" <listserve at catalina38.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 5:47 PM
>> Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Not too long ago I saw a video of a CAL 40 running offshore in a big wind
>> with a heavy kite. They were sustaining over 15 kts and hitting high
>> teens.
>>
>> Does the Santa Crus 37 plane? If it does, 15-20 kts wouldn't be outrageous.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Advice seeking time.
>>
>> So, I've got a friend who sails on a VERY fast boat. A very winning
>> boat. Probably one of the fastest in San Francisco. It's crewed by a
>> bunch of amazing sailors including some Cup guys. However, she's not
>> really a sailor and I've had to explain things like what a knot is vs
>> mph. The boat is a Santa Cruz 37 rates in a 27PHRF. Now, she claims and
>> has some text messages from other crew saying they've hit 26knots in the
>> bay. I call BS. I pull out all my math on hull speed, plain force
>> calculations on what it would take to make that boat go into full plane.
>> I've tried showing what PHRF means and that a 27 means they only average
>> 1/2 knot faster than the J/105's. I've tried pulling out their race
>> times and showing they're only averaging about 6-7knots during races. .
>> This does not matter.
>>
>> Probably most of us have seen exceedences in hull speed for our boats
>> going down waves and whatnot. However, that's not the claim. The claim
>> is they REGULARLY go 16-20 knots in bay races. This is 2x or more their
>> hull speed. .
>>
>> Thoughts on how to explain this or anyone have experience with a SC37?
>>
>> Anders
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Respectfully,
>> David Hadfield
>>
>> Plan-B Design Group
>> 2011 E Gage Ave
>> LA, CA 90255
>> dahadfield at gmail.com
>> SKYPE david.alan.hadfield
>> www.bit.ly/planbdesigngroup
>>
>> 310.871.2012 C
>>
>>
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