[C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor

[Anders Finn]

I think the question is more of surging vs sustained speed. We've narrowed it down to inside SF bay so they're not surfing. I still don't believe the 26 knots surging (without tide) inside the bay. .  Just dont. I CAN believe 16 knot surges though for a few seconds.

They do claim 23 knots sustained surfing during the costal cup. . Course, we've done 15 knots surfing on our c38 when no one else was watching. . .right dad? hehe

Anders


On Sep 13, 2011, at 10:37 PM, Steve Smolinske wrote:

> Maybe the confusion is incorrectly using terminology planing versus surfing, our displacement boats and all displacement boats can catch a wave and surf. 
> 
> ________________________________
> 
> From: listserve-bounces at catalina38.org on behalf of Patrick Harpole
> Sent: Tue 9/13/2011 10:29 PM
> To: Catalina 38 Listserve
> Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
> 
> 
> I referred to a "displacement " which cannot plane.  I have about 20,000 pounds in my keel.  It will not plane.
> There is no limit to the speed of a planing vessel.  That's is why catamarans go mast.
> While in Florida I saw Whitbread (if you are not familiar....this is a race around the world) boats.  I would not call them nor America's Cup boats displacement vessels.  They are very light and have winged keels that bring them out of the water.
> Patrick
> P.S.  what is the fastest tack for a sailing boat?  Clue:  it is not downwind.
> 
> 	----- Original Message ----- 
> 	From: David A Hadfield <mailto:dahadfield at gmail.com>  
> 	To: Catalina 38 Listserve <mailto:listserve at catalina38.org>  
> 	Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 6:16 PM
> 	Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor
> 
> 	Patrick
> 	
> 	On being uninformed.
> 	
> 	The SC37 can plane in downwind attitudes, 
> 	ie. go faster than calculated hull speed. 
> 	
> 	These are apples and oranges and one must be careful on exactly what one is addressing.
> 	
> 	
> 	
> 	On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 6:10 PM, Patrick Harpole <1derful at comcast.net> wrote:
> 	
> 
> 		I sail a Catalina 38 and reached 12 to 14 knots sailing from Benecia to Berkeley.  The reason for the speed is an ebb current at 6 knots.
> 		There is no way a displacement vessel can reach greater than their calculated hull speed.  When one exceeds hull speed they are unduly stressing their rig...which might come down.  What a shame for being stupid.
> 		Patrick
> 		----- Original Message ----- From: <david at dlrfilms.com>
> 		To: "Catalina 38 Listserve" <listserve at catalina38.org>
> 		Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 5:47 PM
> 		Subject: Re: [C38] How to approach an argument with a sailor 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 			Not too long ago I saw a video of a CAL 40 running offshore in a big wind
> 			with a heavy kite. They were sustaining over 15 kts and hitting high
> 			teens.
> 			
> 			Does the Santa Crus 37 plane? If it does, 15-20 kts wouldn't be outrageous.
> 			
> 			
> 			
> 			
> 
> 				Advice seeking time.
> 				
> 				So, I've got a friend who sails on a VERY fast boat. A very winning
> 				boat. Probably one of the fastest in San Francisco. It's crewed by a
> 				bunch of amazing sailors including some Cup guys. However, she's not
> 				really a sailor and I've had to explain things like what a knot is vs
> 				mph. The boat is a Santa Cruz 37 rates in a 27PHRF. Now, she claims and
> 				has some text messages from other crew saying they've hit 26knots in the
> 				bay. I call BS. I pull out all my math on hull speed, plain force
> 				calculations on what it would take to make that boat go into full plane.
> 				I've tried showing what PHRF means and that a 27 means they only average
> 				1/2 knot faster than the J/105's. I've tried pulling out their race
> 				times and showing they're only averaging about 6-7knots during races. .
> 				This does not matter.
> 				
> 				 Probably most of us have seen exceedences in hull speed for our boats
> 				going down waves and whatnot. However, that's not the claim. The claim
> 				is they REGULARLY go 16-20 knots in bay races. This is 2x or more their
> 				hull speed. .
> 				
> 				Thoughts on how to explain this or anyone have experience with a SC37?
> 				
> 				Anders
> 				
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> 
> 	-- 
> 	Respectfully,
> 	David Hadfield
> 	
> 	Plan-B Design Group
> 	2011 E Gage Ave
> 	LA, CA 90255
> 	dahadfield at gmail.com
> 	SKYPE david.alan.hadfield
> 	www.bit.ly/planbdesigngroup
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